End float. How much is too much before the block becomes an anchor?

[monk_13]

I bought a spare motor awhile back, with the intentions of rebuilding it. The motor had shit itself, due to a bit of end float, and a possibly spun bearing.

Anyhow, got the engine home, stripped it down to see exactly what the damage was, and fuck me drunk, the end float was more than a little...

Basically almost a couple mm has been shaved off the journals and main caps. Bearings hadn't been damaged as I had thought, well except for the metal that has been shaved off the side.

So the question is, is the block able to be saved? End caps, bearings etc, were all going to be replaced/upgraded anyway, so I am not worried about that. Anyone had any experience rebuilding a motor that has suffered from this?

Plan is to possibly stroke it, forgies etc and run twin turbos down the track, with the aim of around 450ish at the wheels. Will it last? Or should I just bite the bullet and get a fresh block?

Pics:
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1042/4724070602_09a6a1c41d_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1328/4723412085_5042bd3556_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1126/4724062874_79f2c81b0c_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1107/4724061170_3327fc72de_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1418/4724059068_645197c583_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1167/4724057132_f3290257de_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1108/4724055202_51cdf671dc_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1131/4724050730_49c9e68094_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1188/4723389631_87b96dbeee_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1087/4724036802_973bd3cecb_b.jpg

I know I should just take it into a machine shop and ask, but I just haven't gotten around to it yet.

Cheers
Shane

[beatle]

The best person to speak to is Tony @ Noztec in bentley
Noztec Crankshafts
UNIT 1 / 35 TATE STREET, Bentley, WA 6102

Canning, Perth Southern Suburbs
p: (08)9358 5150 f: (08)9358 5150

[180SXTCY]

Do these engines run thrust bearing between the crank and block?

[monk_13]

Do these engines run thrust bearing between the crank and block?

They do indeed run thrust bearings. You can see what is left of one in the first pic.

[180SXTCY]

indeed you can. i was on my phone when i posted before.

I'm not an expert on these engines, but from what i understand its the thrust bearings that stop the crank moving forward and back. Now due to the bearing caps and block being worn down a few mm's, can u get oversize thrust bearings to pick up this slop or is there only one size available?

personally if building a high hp engine, id start with a crank that doesn't need to be touched, at the very worst a slight polish up on the journals, and a fresh block.

[monk_13]

I'm sure you can get different sized thrust bearings, but with that much worn away.... I dont know if I would want to. Was more thinking along the lines of getting the surface built up and then machined back to spec.

The end caps will be purchased new, crank will also be a new one. Either OEM, or if I can stretch it, something like THIS (http://www.gtmotorsports.com/product.php?productid=16505&cat=264&page=1)

[180SXTCY]

that crank is fukn sexy!

best thing to do i guess is take it to your preferred machine shop and get their professional advice.

i remember when i got my current sr20 built, we went through a heap of cranks as i didnt want one that needed to be touched.

[monk_13]

Yeah GTM do some nice gear... Another option would be THIS (http://www.gtmotorsports.com/product.php?productid=16501&cat=473&page=2) :D But I don't think the wallet agrees.

Will have to hunt down a good machine shop and see what the go is I guess.

Reccomendations?

[180SXTCY]

If your willing to make the trip SOR, take it to Ron Bells in Mandurah and speak to nathan.

Very good machine shop and they wont fuck you around

[S133LTR]

Go see Harris in ozzy park.

Engine manual will have a tolerance for endfloat on the crank.

I would guess that having all the sufraces in a used cast block 'built up' (with weld i assume??) would be more expensive (and quite difficult) than buying another block?

[monk_13]

I'm kind of thinking that building up and machining the surface would be pricey. But if it is cheaper (and still going to be reliable at my esired HP/rpm levels) I wouldn't mind chasing it up.

New block through Nissan Aus is around $2200 from memory, and listed at around $1300 from the states (guessing shipping would be the killer)

Harris in Ozzy park? got any details?

[S133LTR]

See Mark at Harris engines on Roberts st in osbourne park, they are experienced with nissan motors (and everything else) and do excellent work in good time frames.

Surely you would be able to find another second hand motor for similar money to those new blocks your talking about? IMO it would work out cheaper than repairing the motor you have after trying to have the block, main caps and crank welded (if anyone would even do it) and then having the motor line bored and tourqe plat honed/bored aswell as the other general machining which goes with reconditioning/rebuilding a motor?

[joshg123]

Mark did Kueks VQ's machining when i built his.

I personally would start with a fresh one if your wanting performance. You might be able to make that one work, but with the amount of money you would put into the build elsewhere, is it really worth cutting this corner now?

[Miggy]

Mark did Kueks VQ's machining when i built his.

I personally would start with a fresh one if your wanting performance. You might be able to make that one work, but with the amount of money you would put into the build elsewhere, is it really worth cutting this corner now?

Even though you're not planning on running massive power I agree with this 100%.

[monk_13]

See Mark at Harris engines on Roberts st in osbourne park, they are experienced with nissan motors (and everything else) and do excellent work in good time frames.

Surely you would be able to find another second hand motor for similar money to those new blocks your talking about? IMO it would work out cheaper than repairing the motor you have after trying to have the block, main caps and crank welded (if anyone would even do it) and then having the motor line bored and tourqe plat honed/bored aswell as the other general machining which goes with reconditioning/rebuilding a motor?

I know of a few motors getting around, but all are complete, which wouldn't usually worry me, but I already have heads and all the other bits n pieces. All the internals of the motor are going to be brand new.


Mark did Kueks VQ's machining when i built his.

I personally would start with a fresh one if your wanting performance. You might be able to make that one work, but with the amount of money you would put into the build elsewhere, is it really worth cutting this corner now?

You make a valid point there Josh. Cheers.


Even though you're not planning on running massive power I agree with this 100%.

The plan in my head right now, is to over engineer the motor. Basically, build it to hold 600rwhp/7500ish rpm, but set it to run at about 450/6500ish. I have a funny feeling I will end up wringing the cars neck at the track, so hopefully this will help the motor live for a relatively long time.

Thanks guys. Will now set about saving some more dollars up, and turning the current block into a coffee table.

Anyone know of a place I could get a glass coffee table top cut? :D

[_oz]

crank looks to be well fucked, wouldnt bother taking the risk of trying to make that work but the last 3 pics show quite abit of damage to the main tunnels on the block side, aswell

the only thing that would even make me consider TRYING to make that bottom end work would be if theres no other one left in australia and i doubt thats the case

have some piece of mind, find one in better condition and work with that

[Lonewolf]

+1
Imagine forking out the cash only to find that there was something that had the clearances off and had to start from scratch anyway.

I think had it just been a spun bearing etc you wouldnt have a drama, but thats some serious damage to multiple components

[Reverb]

Crank can always get ground as along as the fillets are able to be repaired.

[beefcake]

load it up and pop into harris , that guy will tell you yay or nay , they do some magic on our race motor , it looks rough as guts in the pics but you could be surprised what can be repaired and used quite safely , just don't count your block an crank out until a pro has cast judgement on it .

[sprint347]

+1 for Mark @ Harris

Personally I wouldn't invest all that money (forgies etc) into a block and crank in that condition, but I'm certainly not a Nissan expert.

[ovaxitd]

isnt that factory nissan??