Engineering Certificates, Upload yours

[R3SSSPECT]

Hi guys

just wondering if anyone who has had thier modifications engineered can put up the report on here

i am just interested to see the over all lay out and the testing that is done on the car.
interested to see comments for highmount manifold, afretmarket turbos, aftermarket ECU, exhaust Db, and emmission results.

i am looking into getting my car engineered and i have done a bit of research and found out that a person with a mechanical engineering bachelor degree who is a member of engineering Australia" can sign off a certificate.

The more samples the better.

Alternativly you can email me the copies and i can start a new topic with all the info needed when i have enough samples.
ali.golzar@bindergrp.com

Cheers.

Ali

[Tocchi]

ill try to find my old ones, unsure how they will scan up as they are laminated.

[cactus]

ill try to find my old ones, unsure how they will scan up as they are laminated.


They must be worth a fortune?

[j3rk]

Care to post up more information on the research you've completed in regards to who can sign them off? Always wanted to look into this but never bothered!

[R3SSSPECT]

Thanks Tocchi that would be great!!

here is the document i found on the DPI website
http://www.transport.wa.gov.au/mediaFiles/LBU_VS_IB_102.pdf
not sure if this would work but i want to give it a shot and see what response i get. nothing to lose at the end i guess.

[Fujiwara13]

i am looking into getting my car engineered and i have done a bit of research and found out that a person with a mechanical engineering bachelor degree who is a member of engineering Australia" can sign off a certificate.



Ali

Care to share where you found that out? Always presumed it was so but never found solid proof. If that's all you need I've been thinking about setting up to do it in about a years time. Would be very useful I think.

[Fujiwara13]

Will also write out the gist of mine. Handwriting means I could have nearly any mod I want on my certificates.

[R3SSSPECT]

Care to share where you found that out? Always presumed it was so but never found solid proof. If that's all you need I've been thinking about setting up to do it in about a years time. Would be very useful I think.

i had a look through the recommended parties that were in the table and checked for qualifications.
if you go through the Pdf document i linked in previous post you should be able to find it...

[magic1]

when i finish Bach Civil Eng. :)

[DISTRBD]

I thought the DPI website had a list of approved engineers :confused:

[Kaido]

when i finish Bach Civil Eng. :)




i am looking into getting my car engineered and i have done a bit of research and found out that a person with a mechanical engineering bachelor degree who is a member of engineering Australia" can sign off a certificate.



luck out there magic1!

I am a member of engineering australia, however not finish my mech degree yet! but good to know, i could possible sign off on my own car hahaha

[magic1]

I thought the DPI website had a list of approved engineers :confused:

i did too, but rereading the document is states that people with the correct range of qualifications can sign off.

its normal as the govenment can not be seen to favor certain buinesses.

same with us signing off patios and fences ect, we are reccomended but not required to be used.

[j3rk]

Ha Tris, I do wonder how diligent the transport authority would be in giving the OK for a signatory.
I'd say with a well worded report listing enough of the applicable standards and sufficient 'tests' completed to the parts you'd be fine.

Keen to see what a report looks like!

[DISTRBD]

PM Buckets

[Sfidz]

Contact Terry South
He has engineered quiet a few people's cars I know with highmounts/Rose joint suspension arms etc.
Very well priced usually between $600-$800

Contact details:
Mobile:0417 811 044
Phone: 9310 2939

[upgarage]

i have done a bit of research and found out that a person with a mechanical engineering bachelor degree who is a member of engineering Australia" can sign off a certificate.


where does it say that?

[R3SSSPECT]

where does it say that?

look at the table of recommended contacts and their qualifications.

So anyone willing to upload?!!
i will Pm Buckets and contact Terry to find some more info on this.

[Lonewolf]

you'll likely still need to jump through some hoops to get approved by the DPI though.
Likely need to provide proof of experience in the automotive engineering side of things

[Fujiwara13]

luck out there magic1!

I am a member of engineering australia, however not finish my mech degree yet! but good to know, i could possible sign off on my own car hahaha

You mean you can sign off your mum's car that she paid $500 for, that's unusually insured for $30k.

[Kaido]

You mean you can sign off your mum's car that she paid $500 for, that's unusually insured for $30k.

wtf? i think you are trying to troll the wrong person dude.... no idea who the fuck you are, or what you are on about :)

[Sfidz]

look at the table of recommended contacts and their qualifications.

So anyone willing to upload?!!
i will Pm Buckets and contact Terry to find some more info on this.

I do not see why you need someone to upload engineering certs.
If you are serious about it and not just wasting time you would just Call Terry and he will sort your gear out.

[2jzlux]

Pretty sure it has to be a dpi approved engineer, also when doing the paperwork to be a dpi inspector it said you cannot sign off your own cars so will probably be similar.

[magic1]

You mean you can sign off your mum's car that she paid $500 for, that's unusually insured for $30k.

WHAT?

[Buckets]

PM Buckets

Fair bump, play on. (But fuck you!)


look at the table of recommended contacts and their qualifications.

So anyone willing to upload?!!
i will Pm Buckets and contact Terry to find some more info on this.

Don't PM me I'm a degenerate drunkard of no use to you in this exercise. I design stuff so that it blows up. I doubt you want your vehicle to be blown up or stickered because the cops know I'm a drunkard of no use to you in this exercise and as such ignore my meaningless roadside dribble.

[mr m00se]

lol, you guys realy need to read the whole thing

Signatories recognised by the Department will generally have experience in the automotive
industry and are members of one of the engineering organisations below:
 The Institution of Engineers, Australia (IE Aust); or
 The Society of Automotive Engineers, Australasia (SAE-A) - Automotive Signatory
Group.
This is by no means the only criterion used to ascertain an individual’s suitability to be an
engineering signatory. Some people who have been accepted as signatories hold only
engineering qualifications at Diploma level, but they also have extensive experience in their
specific areas of work.


You have to be approved by the department

[upgarage]

look at the table of recommended contacts and their qualifications.

So anyone willing to upload?!!
i will Pm Buckets and contact Terry to find some more info on this.

So you just assumed you all you need is a degree in mech eng and an engineering membership

read the whole article

also

these guys are great
http://www.southam.com.au/

[RS_Gav]

Don't PM me I'm a degenerate drunkard of no use to you in this exercise. I design stuff so that it blows up. I doubt you want your vehicle to be blown up or stickered because the cops know I'm a drunkard of no use to you in this exercise and as such ignore my meaningless roadside dribble.

No help at all sorry, but faaark I lol'ed at this!

[R3SSSPECT]

lol, you guys realy need to read the whole thing

Signatories recognised by the Department will generally have experience in the automotive
industry and are members of one of the engineering organisations below:
 The Institution of Engineers, Australia (IE Aust); or
 The Society of Automotive Engineers, Australasia (SAE-A) - Automotive Signatory
Group.
This is by no means the only criterion used to ascertain an individual’s suitability to be an
engineering signatory. Some people who have been accepted as signatories hold only
engineering qualifications at Diploma level, but they also have extensive experience in their
specific areas of work.


You have to be approved by the department

By recognised they mean the ones that are actually on the list. This doesnt mean anyone else cant.
it also sais these are the recommended identities and DPI doesnt accept any responsibility for their work.

from overall read or the document a person with:

*Mechanical engineering degree
*member of The Institution of Engineers, Australia (IE Aust); or
The Society of Automotive Engineers, Australasia (SAE-A) - Automotive Signatory
*has extensive expirience in the area of work

[R3SSSPECT]

I do not see why you need someone to upload engineering certs.
If you are serious about it and not just wasting time you would just Call Terry and he will sort your gear out.

i will contact him tomorrow and see what i can find out. but im not sure if he will be happy to inform me of the process he uses so i can use it for gathering information.

[duste]

Fucking LOOOOOL!

By your logic I'll be approving cars n shit next year eh?

WRONG. You need to be in the industry at least 5 years before you'll even get considered for approval.

[R3SSSPECT]

thats not a problem for me. i can have our motorsport engineers at uni to sing the document off it needs be.
this is to gather some information to see some samples and find out whats required.

[duste]

thats not a problem for me. i can have our motorsport engineers at uni to sing the document off it needs be.
this is to gather some information to see some samples and find out whats required.

No, you can't.

Re-read my post. You have to be in the industry for at least 5 years BEFORE APPROVAL. Not anyone can just be 'approved'.

If you're yet to do the modifications, talk to an approved engineer and ask their advice.

If the modifications have already been performed, take the car to an approved engineer and get them to check it over and, if necessary, they will tell you what needs to be fixed.

Far too many pingpingpingpings trying to cut corners in this world. I don't see why it is so difficult to take it to an approved engineer? Stop being a tight-ass.

[Buckets]

Far too many pingpingpingpings trying to cut corners in this world. I don't see why it is so difficult to take it to an approved engineer? Stop being a tight-ass.

No money left after sick as mods?

Go see an approved engineer pay some cash get some shit signed off jobs tidy.

[TJ]

Id rather see a friendly engineer.

[mr m00se]

If it was that easy for any grad engineer to get approval then I would be swimming in a sea of happiness and engineering certs.
Ive got a very good mate who started to look at getting approved (graduated 03 with distinction or something in mech engineering) He built a shite load of carbon fibre chassis for the UWA team as well as doing some pretty decent personal stuff. Anyway when he started the application he was allready on the back foot because they weren't that keen on his experience and enthusiasm for the "performance and race" side of things. Then he has issues getting the professional indemnity insurance and the cost associated with getting every single reg that you need to follow.
In the end he ditched the idea and is currently kite surfing on the Greek islands, lucky bastard

[Sfidz]

i will contact him tomorrow and see what i can find out. but im not sure if he will be happy to inform me of the process he uses so i can use it for gathering information.

So you are too tight to pay someone $600-$800 for peice of mind? Fuck off this forum and stop wasting people's time. Sick of these pointless threads ATM.

[R3SSSPECT]

Dude! Watch what your saying! there is no reason for that kind of language!
its not about being a tight ass! money is not an issue.
its about putting some effort in and getting the job done yourself, instead of being lazy and having someone else do the job for you.
at the end whether it does happen or not, i rather know what is the process and have some back ground knowledge on how this is done! Not just give someone the money and make it their problem!!
Either way, doesn’t look like you are here to help! Its all about criticism with some of you! Ill get my info some other way.
Thanks for people who posted helpful comments.

[regi]

yeah!

not all of us antilag pingpingpings are ballers!

[duste]

Dude! Watch what your saying! there is no reason for that kind of language!
its not about being a tight ass! money is not an issue.
its about putting some effort in and getting the job done yourself, instead of being lazy and having someone else do the job for you.
at the end whether it does happen or not, i rather know what is the process and have some back ground knowledge on how this is done! Not just give someone the money and make it their problem!!
Either way, doesn’t look like you are here to help! Its all about criticism with some of you! Ill get my info some other way.
Thanks for people who posted helpful comments.

What? The approved engineers won't 'do the job for you'. He will tell you what is safe, what isn't, and, in general, what is required for your car to be engineered. You will then go away and either 'get the job done yourself' or pay a workshop to do it and return to the approved engineer once the work is complete for him to inspect, and the cycle continues if shit doesn't work out.

You are paying them for advice, nothing more. Do you really think they would modify/fabricate/etc for $400-800? Yeah nah.

[mr m00se]

When an engineer signs off something for you he is signing that the mod is safe and legal. If shit goes down as a result of the mod and he's signed it off. Then he's going to be in a world of shit.
Ie your highmount gets hot and is not braced properly, droops onto something and causes a fire, car burns to the ground. If you can prove that it was the high mount that caused the fire and the engineer was negligent in this duties, well then have cause to take him to court over damages.

[j3rk]

Re-read my post. You have to be in the industry for at least 5 years BEFORE APPROVAL. Not anyone can just be 'approved'.

What are you basing this on? Personal experience?


Anyway when he started the application he was allready on the back foot because they weren't that keen on his experience and enthusiasm for the "performance and race" side of things.

Mr m00se more info if possible? Are you talking when he started to apply for the engineering cert approval from the DPI or is there an approval process for being a signatory?

[duste]

What are you basing this on? Personal experience?

Was looking in to it last year sometime as I'm studying Mech. Eng. and am quite keen on being approved for engineering these sorts of things. Can't for the life of me remember where I read or heard it from though, but it does make sense; they're not just going to let any recent graduate start approving modifications.

Not that I would approve S13s with RB26/30 swaps on the provisory that they do a sweet skid up the street as they're leaving.

EDIT: Come to think about it, I may have heard it from the engineer who builds all our custom machinery for the laboratory I work at; he's an approved engineer.

[mr m00se]

What are you basing this on? Personal experience?



Mr m00se more info if possible? Are you talking when he started to apply for the engineering cert approval from the DPI or is there an approval process for being a signatory?

It was when he was looking at getting aproval for the department to become a signatory. I dont think he ever got as far as a formal application but he did have allot of long chats with a couple of the blokes that were involved with the approval side of things in the department. Ive got no doubt that he would of got approval eventually but.

[Turbo2.6L]

Once you have engineering certs, do they ever have to be updated? Obviously any new mods wouldn't appear on a dated certificate, but existing mods covered forever & a day or just for a limited lifespan?

[3BEPKA]

I think you have to take it to pits if you put any mod that it's not on the list, then they'll either give you additional mod permit or gonna brake your balls and ask for tech approval and shit.If caught with mods that are not listed,they can and will cancel your permit(eng. cert) and you have to start again :)

[Sfidz]

Dude! Watch what your saying! there is no reason for that kind of language!
its not about being a tight ass! money is not an issue.
its about putting some effort in and getting the job done yourself, instead of being lazy and having someone else do the job for you.
at the end whether it does happen or not, i rather know what is the process and have some back ground knowledge on how this is done! Not just give someone the money and make it their problem!!
Either way, doesn’t look like you are here to help! Its all about criticism with some of you! Ill get my info some other way.
Thanks for people who posted helpful comments.

You are a degenerate.
I know the process of engineering quite well so don't tell me I am here to talk shit.

Engineers do not do the work for you.
You go to the engineer and pay him MONEY to tell you if it is safe etc then you apply to the DPI for permits on the basis that a engineer has signed off on your aftermarket modifications.

From the friends of mine that have had their highmount setups/ suspension arm and coilover suspension setups done they have received yellow stickers prior to getting engineering so I cannot say if you have not received one if you need a pit inspector to make the final sign off on the car.
There is no point getting the engineering permits done untill you get a yellow unless it is a daily car.
Also note that your permits should only be used if there is nothing illegal on your car that is not permitted or the ride hight is legal. If you produce your permits to a officer and your ride hight is too low your entire sheet of permits is now invalid.
Engineering permits should be used more as a easy way to get across the pits with a highly modified car rather than avoiding stickers, just take it on the chin an know that when you rock up to the pits with your ride hight raised/screemer plumbed back in etc you can sail across.

Your engineering certs will only need to be updated when you want to add on more modifications so if you have not done all your suspension mods before getting your car engineered don't bother untill you do to save screwing around.
I hope this clears up some issues.

[DISTRBD]

I think you have to take it to pits if you put any mod that it's not on the list, then they'll either give you additional mod permit or gonna brake your balls and ask for tech approval and shit.If caught with mods that are not listed,they can and will cancel your permit(eng. cert) and you have to start again :)



So they did that to you did they ??

[200MPH]

An engineer does not have to be on the list of approved signatories in order to sign off an engineering report. However Transport do tend to ask for a CV of the engineer if they're not familar with them.

After engineering approval the car still needs to go over the pits to the satisfaction of the inspector on the day. So if you are going all out with something that may be radical/borderline and get it past engineering, you still may have a fight to get it past final inspection.

Regarding the rest of the thread - no direct experience and hence no comment.

[3BEPKA]

So they did that to you did they ??

Not yet :) what I wrote in my previous post is what I was told by pit inspector who sign off the final mod permit,he was really nice guy (John Carte at Welshool pits).
Just to add few things from personal experiance for guys that are interested.

After you find the engineer who goes over car and "approve" all the mods (needs to pass noise and emission tests),than he sends that report to TECH section of dpi who will write you a letter that you need to take to final vehicle examination.That letter still doesn't mean you gonna pass inspection but at least gives you some chance.
"be aware that compliance with the VSB 14 does not guarantee that a vehicle will be acceptable for registration in case of a modified registered production vehicle."
So I guess it all comes to final examiner,if you get wanker you are fucked.

[Dr.J]

Yep. ^
I currently own a car that is basically as modified from stock as it can possibly be, so I can attest to all of what's been previously mentioned here by Duste, Sfidz, and 3BEPKA.
Do everything properly the first time, or do it more than once.

[Chum]

I had to get an engineers report for my sparco sprint seats and bonds half bolt in cage. Most charge heaps, but I used this old retired German lad called Hillerin Romeo (he's in the list of approved engineers) and he charged $200 for the signatories with report. Others quoted $500-$1000. The car is road legal btw.

[DCIEVE]

If it was that easy for any grad engineer to get approval then I would be swimming in a sea of happiness and engineering certs.
Ive got a very good mate who started to look at getting approved (graduated 03 with distinction or something in mech engineering) He built a shite load of carbon fibre chassis for the UWA team as well as doing some pretty decent personal stuff. Anyway when he started the application he was allready on the back foot because they weren't that keen on his experience and enthusiasm for the "performance and race" side of things. Then he has issues getting the professional indemnity insurance and the cost associated with getting every single reg that you need to follow.
In the end he ditched the idea and is currently kite surfing on the Greek islands, lucky bastard

Odd. I spoke to tech section some time ago about signing off on a car - they only wanted to see a CV with the report demonstrating an acceptable level of experience.

To the undergrads and grads, your not an IEAust member until you have three years experience, until then your a graduate member (or a student member if still studying). Though I suspect this requirement only exists to weed out grad's trying to sign off on there mates dodgy mods.

200MPH is spot on the money. But then I suspect he has engineered a few cars.

[mr m00se]

Tech never seem to have thier act together or know what happening.

My mate went through the process about 4 years ago but it seems that its changed from a pannel level to an inspector level for the department recognition

Signatories recognised by the Department will generally have experience in the automotive
industry and are members of one of the engineering organisations below:
 The Institution of Engineers, Australia (IE Aust); or
 The Society of Automotive Engineers, Australasia (SAE-A) - Automotive Signatory
Group.
This is by no means the only criterion used to ascertain an individual’s suitability to be an
engineering signatory. Some people who have been accepted as signatories hold only
engineering qualifications at Diploma level, but they also have extensive experience in their
specific areas of work.

[AntonRX]

I was a bit lazy and didn't read through all the posts but ill just put up what I have learnt as I am getting my rx7 s2 engineered atm before I sell it.

You can only use approved people by dpi from the list is what I have been told.
Generally around 500-600 but could be more depending on what you need.

They want you to fill in the form on the dpi web site stating what you want to do to your car (or have already done), which the tech at midland pit inspection said I have to fill in first and then send away which can take 5-6weeks to process. However after talking to my engineer he got me to fill in the form the best I could and he filled in what I didn't know. He send forms away which get processed quicker. Anyway I'll start with the process I went through after finding the info above.
1. Engineer came around took some picture of the car and got me to fill in dpi forms which he modifed. (He told me to include everything changed on car). He also took it for a good drive. If it doesn't feel safe in any way they won't pass it.

2. He looks at specifications for any problems I might have according to manufacture specification and legal changes that can be made.He went through a few things I had to fix up before he sent the forms off (no point sending off forms and getting a 'no' from the dpi.) For me I had to get an emission test, 2 cat converters and they want to see some more picture of my exhaust. (I had already done most the work)

3. Now the above is done the forms are being sent of to get approval and modification permits. Modification permits I have been told are generally very broad. eg. "engine performance modifications" "brake modifications' "wheel modifications" etc So technically you can alter items that are on your permit sheet and it will still look like you have permits for it.

Once I have all the paper work and approval back I then take the car over the pits (my car is unlicensed) they can't touch me for stuff on permits and I am done. I am getting permits for hilux diff, wheel, brakes, turbo and engine modifications.

[3BEPKA]

I think you have been told wrong,mod permit is not that broad and they list every mod in details so you can't just alter it.You may receive letter of approval,but to get mod permit you must pass pits.