ANZ can get fukced !

[mxracer]

need to rant hard right now , just be fucked by the bank.

and possibly a warning for other people out there.

i did a pay anyone transaction to another anz account ( buying stuff from someone )
sum of $1150 , with anz its instant .. so after a few minutes the funds didnt show .. , rechecked the account numbers and bsb and the fucktard seller wrote 012006 bsb number as 072006 .. < did like a running writing carried the "0" to the "1" and clearly looked like a "07"

so after that failed attempt i did it with the correct numbers and all was sweet . rang the bank straight away to let them know of the mistake , they said that bsb is invalid and should bounce back in a few days , if not ring back and we file a dispute.

anyway few days later no luck , called made dispute and said they need 6-8 weeks to investigate.

i got a friday 13th letter today saying ..

we couldnt find the money , nothin we can do , sorry , if u wish to pursue further then get a lawyer.

so limbo/the bank has scored my money , and unless i pour money into a lawyer which id prob end up lossing the case anyway cause bank laywers and stupid hidden disclosures would have it all covered .

so pissed off !! im going to take my 2x home loans ( about 600k ) out of anz asap.. so if anyone knows a good mortage broker let me know .. i dont want these pingpingpingpingS getting anymore of my money.

[KAL SPL]

Have you been into a branch to try sort it out ?

[mxracer]

i rang the help line straight away .. said the exact thing as the letter.

nothin we can do , get a lawyer if you wanna pursue ..

would the branch do anything different to the help hotline ?

[SircatmaN]

I would never use ANZ, I'm not sure whats going on there lately or if new CEO's have taken over but I have been hearing nothing but bad things, not to mention the fact they keep raising interest rates AGAINST the reserve bank. They are a junk yard dog without a leash, but for some reason people have these bad experiences and still don't change banks, the only way you can get your point across is to take your savings accounts and mortgages etc and move, and tell them why.
I would defeniatly see a lawyer though, money does not simply "disappear".

Also this is the reason you have to put in the owners name, I'm pretty sure that it all has to match up and if it doesn't then it is clearly an error and has gone to the wrong person. I thinkt he question you need to ask is if the ANZ accidentally sent their money somewhere, would they be able to track where it went?

[TJ]

http://www.fos.org.au/centric/home_page.jsp

[Lmx]

The raising the rates against the reserve bank is fine imo, the rates are just coming even with the other banks.
Try and go into the branch, i think they will be more likely to attempt to help you

[mr_rotary]

Good explanation of why rates are going up:
http://www.businessspectator.com.au/bs.nsf/Article/mortgage-interest-rates-BOQ-property-Peter-Dorrian-pd20120328-SSR3J?OpenDocument&src=spb

[Alt_F4]

BSB is invalid = no transaction = them trying to scam you

[mxracer]

^^ exactly .. the nerve they have to say .. too bad ..
copy of the letter i got today.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y3/slylux/scan00012.jpg

did a search at www.bsbnumbers.com/

its invalid bsb !

[MGR]

http://www.fos.org.au/centric/home_page.jsp

This.

[2LMILK]

i fucked anz off aswell. went to police and nurses.

ANZ are useless pingpingpingpings, cant do anything right

[Adr3naL1N]

ANZ are useless so are CBA. ANZ are rediculously expensive on fees as well.


I might not be right

but it is my understanding that a banking representative is meant to check that the name you put on the transfer is meant to match up to the bsb and account number. In your case the bsb/acc number would not of matched the name. They have obviosuly failed to see check that it did not match. This would mean that ANZ would be held liable for the funds and need to reimburse you. I would definitely take this further if i were you.

A few weeks ago i had to transfer a grand to someone, my bank being westpac and his being bankwest, he gave me the wrong bsb. A day later it bounced back with a note saying incorrect name/bsb. Obviously westpac are checking their transfers and ANZ are not.

[mxracer]

this is what net banking sayings when doing a transfer

IMPORTANT: All details entered must be correct. In processing payments, ANZ does not check that the Account Number entered matches the Account Name or BSB details provided. To the extent permitted by law, ANZ is not liable for loss arising from any error in instructions given by you or an authorised user.

and down the bottom

Important Information

It is your responsibility to ensure that the details provided by you are correct or your transfer may be unsuccessful or may be paid to an unintended account. We do not check that the details provided by you are correct.

Pay Anyone transfers requested before 6.00pm (AEST) on a PayAnyone Processing Day (Monday to Friday, except any day that is a public holiday in both Sydney and Melbourne) will be processed to your account on the same day. Transfers requested after this time may be processed on the following Pay Anyone Processing day. When the payee's account will be credited will depend on the policy and systems of the payee's bank.

You cannot delete or cancel an immediate transfer or a transfer to be processed today.

Future-dated transfers require cleared funds in your account at 12.00am (midnight AEST) on the day before the scheduled transfer date or your transfer will be unsuccessful.

To delete a future dated transfer, go to 'Future Payments/Transfers'.

You cannot amend a recurring transfer. You must delete the existing recurring transfer series by selecting the recurring transfer series under the 'Future Payments/Transfers' menu option and then set up a new recurring transfer series.


so how well does that cover their ass's even if a lawyer was to look over it ??
ps thanks for the link Tj , processed a application as soon as the link popped up ..

[anton]

after 7 years they still send all my mail to the incorrect address i have never gotten a statment or a bill from them ever and no mater how many time i call go in to correct it never happens, ANZ are useless wont process any further accounts or loans with them.. period!

[carlos spicy wener]

seems like they have covered their arses well in the footnotes. i would do the same, take my money elsewhere.

[mxracer]

haha yea .. they still have harvey east rd on my address .. its hardey east rd , u dumb ping pings .. !!. im lucky to even get the mail from them ..

[Buckets]

The best thing to do is get to know your local branch manager regardless of which bank your with. I know my local manager quite well (even though I'm far from a high rolling customer) and if anything goes wrong I bypass all the usual process's and rock up at the bank the next business day and I've never not had an issue resolved. Netbanks cool but if you want service and not "computer says no" go to the branch have a chat and see what's going on. These people know how to bend the bank rules to help and most of them will do what it takes to help a good customer.

[2LV8ETR]

i fucked anz off aswell. went to police and nurses.

This is where I went, happy as fuck.

What a lot of people fail to realise is that no business can write off their responsibilities if they contravene any laws/regulations/COP's/trade practices. They can say whetever thay like, but at the end of the day they still have to abide by the established laws/practices.

[mys1]

Lol at letter,

for "Privacy resons" we can not disclose any more info - the BSB is wrong/doesnt exist so it hasnt gone to anyone there fore - GIVE ME BACK MY MONEY YOU FUCKS! would be the letter I would be sending them.

[MrButtnekid]

Wait until Monday, I'll post something up for you to write back to them, all legal like ;). You can go to the financial ombudsman

[HANS YOLO]

http://www.austasiagroup.com/simon.htm

Call my broker, Simon is his name...tell him Chuck sent you - the guy is a genius and very very helpfull (thats if you want out of ANZ into a better deal....or just some sound financial advice)

[2JZA70]

they are full of shit martin!!! I made a mistake...sendt 2k(using nab) to a mate incorrect bsb also invalid...money came back after 5 days!! would you belive i was sending to an ANZ account!!

[Missile]

The BSB does exist http://bsbnumbers.com/?bsb=012-006

I believe the process that has to be followed is:
You complain to bank
Bank gets in touch with incorrect recipient
Incorrect recipient has to confirm receipt of money and approve to have it taken from account e.g. bank cannot simply remove the funds on their own accord
Money will be transferred back to your account

So with the above info in hand, I would say the the incorrect recipient has told the bank to f@#k off and are keeping your funds, hence why a lawyer will need to be involved.

[Alt_F4]

The BSB does exist http://bsbnumbers.com/?bsb=012-006
Congrats, you've just confirmed that the ANZ account he meant to send it to, is in fact, an ANZ account.

There is no 072-006 BSB

[Missile]

Yep, I fkd up!

[180SXTCY]

Money simply doesn't disappear, what a bunch of Muppet's. Don't give up on it mate, $1150 is a lot of money to just loose. Banks need to be able to trace everything no matter how big or small the transaction is and know exactly where the money has gone.

[2LMILK]

Funny thing is if anz put $1150 into your account by accident, they would take it back right away without any questions

[Aristoman]

Funny thing is if anz put $1150 into your account by accident, they would take it back right away without any questions

THIS ^

[TKO Tinting]

Ive had a similar problem, best to go into your bank and speak to the man in charge with all your relevant paperwork.
If that doesnt work well then Martin you got screwed!!!
btw my broker advised me about 6 months ago to move everything from ANZ and the help I get from my new bank is 10 fold.

[stumps.]

I have found anz to be very helpful with both my mortgage (mortgage broker) and all my accounts and even getting my money back when people haven't sent me things. Go into the bank and see the manager. Tell him you will switch your mortgages to another bank and i'm sure they will help you out.

[Turbo2.6L]

Westpac go alright imo. Change from ANZ if they don't rectify this mess...

[Damo 69]

Get a credit card with my mortgage with very little effort, rack up a huge debt, pay it off, ask for it to be cancelled wait on the phone for 45minutes – then get told to cancel the credit card I will need to come into one of the branches - carnts

[mxracer]

going to head into a branch today .. if all goes pear shaped im going to pull my savings out in cash there and then , and yes start getting the ball rolling for re-finance .. which might not be easy as im only working part time and gone from 150k pa to 48k pa . so not sure who will lend me the money.

[MrButtnekid]

Dear Muppet at ANZ:

The purpose of this letter is to advise of the mistaken payment that has been made by electronic funds transfer to the above BSB and Account number from our ANZ account BSB:?? Acc: ??.

This letter also requests that the mistaken payment be returned to me.

The payment was made on ?? in the amount of $1,150.00.

The Account Name entered for each transaction, being the intended recipient of these funds, was ???. The error is contained within the account number entered as the correct BSB number for ??? is ??? rather than ??? entered.

I first ascertained that the funds had been mistakenly paid to the wrong account on or about ??? . I immediately contacted ANZ and requested that they arrange for the funds to be returned.

On ??? ANZ advised me that your customer had not answered any of the letters that had been sent however ANZ has also advised me verbally that the account number is a non-active ANZ account.

ANZ has now advised me orally that it does not consider it liable to the funds and that I should obtain legal advice.

It is necessary for me to explain the basis upon which the position ANZ seeks to adopt is legally incorrect and untenable.

As you are no doubt aware, payment made under a mistake of fact is prima facie recoverable under the principle of unjust enrichment. See David Securities v Commonwealth Bank of Australia (1992) 175 CLR 353.

The payment is made to the receiving bank, in this case ANZ, and not to the ultimate payee. See Royal Products Ltd v Midland Bank Ltd [1981] 2 Lloyd’s Rep 194; Dovey v Bank of New Zealand [2000] 3 NZLR 641.

The payment made under a mistake of fact is therefore, prima facie recoverable from the receiving bank, and as such ANZ remains under a prima facie liability to return the funds to me. See David Securities v Commonwealth Bank of Australia.

Contrary to the advice provided by your telephone representative, that I should take legal action against your client, before legal action is taken against your client, it is up to the ANZ bank, as the receiving bank, to establish a defence: See David Securities v Commonwealth Bank of Australia.

While ANZ's position is seemingly that it received the funds as agent and has “accounted” to its principal (your customer), it is not enough that ANZ has simply credited the account of its customer: See Australia and New Zealand Banking Group Ltd v Westpac Banking Corporation (1988) 164 CLR 662. Further such a position is untenable given you have also advised me that the account is a non-active ANZ account. That is, on your own admissions, there is no customer, the funds have remained within the ANZ group.

Even if your customer (which you state there is not one) has drawn on the account into which the mistaken payment was made, there is no clear reason to displace the normal rule in Devaynes v Noble (Clayton's Case) (1816) 1 Mer 572. That is, if the funds paid into your client’s account by mistake are still in the account, ANZ can still not establish the “accounted to principal” defence.

ANZ, as the receiving bank, should return the payment and debit the account of its customer (if there is in fact one) unless it believes that it can establish conclusively that it has "accounted'' to its customer. Given I notified ANZ of the mistaken payment on ???, I am of the firm view that unless ANZ can establish that prior to this date:
1. all of the funds that were present in your client’s account prior to the making of the mistaken deposit had been withdrawn, and the mistaken payment of $1,150 had also been withdrawn; and
2. any additional funds deposited into your client’s account between the date when the $1,150 was deposited and the date I first contacted you regarding the mistaken payment as well as the $1,150 itself have been withdrawn,
ANZ has no defence and is liable to return the monies to me.

If your customer has closed the account or if it may be shown in some other way that ANZ has "accounted'' to its customer, then and only then must I pursue your customer instead of ANZ as the receiving bank. As it is the responsibility of ANZ as the receiving bank to establish the defence, ANZ must therefore produce evidence that it has indeed “accounted” to its customer, and this in turn will require the disclosure of your customer's name. This disclosure is clearly within the "own interest'' exception of Tournier v National Provincial and Union Bank of England [1924] 1 KB 461.

Accordingly before I take the ANZ's advice to commence legal proceedings to which, by necessity, ANZ will be a party, I invite you to respond to this letter by either:
1. returning the $1,150 in full; or
2. producing evidence that conclusively establishes that ANZ has “accounted to its customer”, which will include disclosing the name of your customer to me,

by close of business (give them a week).

I request that you also provide a copy of this letter to your client, being the holder of account BSB ??? Acc: ??? (the account into which the mistaken payment was made). Your client should be under no misconception, they have been unjustly enriched and if required, I will legally pursue them for the return of these funds in the event that ANZ has “accounted” to them.

Might I also add that according to the website http://bsbnumbers.com/?bsb=012-006, the BSB 072-006 does exist. The implication in the letter sent to me dated ?? is to the effect that there is a third party recipient into whose account the $1,150 was mistakenly deposited. In circumstances where there is no BSB of the number mistakenly entered, there can be no recipient as claimed by you. YOur conduct in respresenting the existance of a third party recipient is therefore misleading and deceptive and actionable at law under the Competition and Consumer Act (formerly section 52 of the Trade Practice Act).

If you fail to respond to this letter within the stipulated time frame, I reserve the right to commence proceedings against you and your client without further notice.

Furthermore you and your client should also note that I will rely upon this letter in support of a claim for costs against both you and your client. In this regard, I have a binding costs agreement with my existing legal advisor which provides that the hourly rates in excess of the relevant Supreme Court Costs Determination are applicable and I will instruct our solicitors to seek to have their bill taxed on an indemnity basis in accordance with the costs agreement.

Yours sincerely


BUTTMONKEY

[MrButtnekid]

PS I offer no legal advice nor make any warranties as to the correctness of the legal argument nor cases cited in the above post and it remains purely my unprofessional opinion offered for nil consideration and on a purely free basis

[2LV8ETR]

Fucking take that ANZ!

[_S9_]

For the record - that BSB might well exist if its registered to a PRIVATE bank? (or am I speculating shit?)

ie. http://bsb.apca.com.au/public/BSB_DB.NSF/publicBSB.xsp

I know that site doesn't list the BSB as valid - but it still _could_ be a financial institution of some kind right?
(hence ANZ are unable to recover the monies as they are not members of a regulated industry body?)

(Purely guessing here)

[Adr3naL1N]

i hope none of the other 3 banks dont follow anz's lead on increasing rates and heaps of their customer take their mortgage elsewhere.

[Mad_Aussie]

For the record - that BSB might well exist if its registered to a PRIVATE bank? (or am I speculating shit?)


All banks are private banks

[Bomber]

orally
LOL Simple things ahaha :D

[MrButtnekid]

haha out of that whole page, you took 'orally' Fucking LOL

[Turbo2.6L]

going to head into a branch today .. if all goes pear shaped im going to pull my savings out in cash there and then , and yes start getting the ball rolling for re-finance .. which might not be easy as im only working part time and gone from 150k pa to 48k pa . so not sure who will lend me the money.

If you have enough equity & can service the loans, you'll be fine.

[mxracer]

well going into the bank is like dealing with a different company , the lady that serviced me was shocked at such a letter and couldnt understand why it was so blunt and negative ..

she rang the service help line just like i did , but once introducing herself as an anz employee they worked with her over the confusion .. and they are looking into it asap. both the branch lady and the call centre service adviser can see that the funds are in limbo , and trying to rectify the issue. hopefully ill know in 48 hrs or so ..

still prob a good idea to re-finance .. but ill take one step at a time .. good to see i can rely on the advise from other antilaggers ..see we arent all just hoons out to do skids ! there is def some good knowledge in this forum ..

ps thanks for the "orally" a well thought out bit of writing you have constructed.

[Aristoman]

Here here....

http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2010/4/25/129167345763136150.gif

[VRX]

Imagine if the situation was reversed..they would be throwing around threats of criminal prosecution.

[iluv2moan]

hate to rub it in but i fucked up 1 digit in someones account number the otherday (and didnt realise) on a net bank transfer... without having to call the bank (commonwealth) the 150 was returned minus a 2.50 fee..

[mxracer]

would u believe the shit still continues !!!

when i went into the bank and the nice lady helped me .. the service center was suppose to contact me on the 18th april ..

well a week later i thought ill ring back and see what the go is ..

the curry muncher on the line said ....

it has a note here saying to ring customer complaints on 1800 bla bla bla ..

no word back from the ombudsman

the saga continues

[BIGS]

ANZ are good for commercial loans, seem to be ahead of the other banks in this area. Can't really say I've had any bad experiences just yet.

I can suggest a really good broker(I'm biased because im going to be working for him) other brokers have reffered clients to him as he could help where they couldn't. Pm me if you want to know more.

[MrButtnekid]

Dood send the letter, you will have your money back in 7 days

[SircatmaN]

I would send the letter.

Although be prepared to be dragged into court because banks dont get rich by handing out money, and I dare say they have lawyers on payrole and they might be willing to bet that you cant afford legal fees over $1150 and will drop the case.

[BIGS]

Which branch are you with?